Mamy produkty takie same jak Caparol, tylko że tańsze ….

Z racji tego, że w internetach tak bardzo kochane są koty podobno, niech mina tego czarnego sierściucha stanie się odzwierciedleniem mojego zdziwienia, kiedy to usłyszałem tekst z tytułu tego wpisu czyli:

Mamy produkty tej samej jakości co Caparol, tylko że tańsze.

Słowa te wypowiedział jeden z tzw. doradców techniczno-handlowych producenta, nazwy którego z powodu resztek czystej przyzwoitości nie wymienię podczas spotkania ze mną po wcześniejszym umówieniu się.

Zaczynając od początku:

gdzieś w okolicach września 2016r zadzwonił telefon, nic w tym dziwnego w sumie, bo ten cholerny telefon potrafi w sezonie dzwonić bez przerwy. Odbieram, w słuchawce słyszę wyćwiczony głos PH i jakże standardowe zdanie otwierające:

Dzień dobry nazywam się (najzwijmy Pana „PAN M”) reprezentuję firmę M i chciałbym umówić się z Panem na spotkanie.

Podchodząc dość sceptycznie zarówno do Pana M jak i do firmy, którą wymienił staram się człowiekowi wytłumaczyć, że traci trochę czas zarówno swój jak i mój, bo niekoniecznie produkty z jego oferty mogą mnie interesować, ponadto mam to dość dobrze poukładane z kim współpracuję (Dryvit, STO, Caparol), jego firmę już „przećwiczyłem” i raczej biznesu to on ze mną nie zrobi. Jedyne co możemy ubić to nie interes, a muchę w kiblu.

Pan M nie zrażony moją niechęcią nalegał na spotkanie, zatem żeby nie było, że olewam człowieka wyznaczyłem termin spotkania dogodny dla obu stron, tj. za trzy dni i poprosiłem tylko, żeby przyjechał do tej rozmowy przygotowany.

Mineły 3 dni, godzinę przed spotkaniem Pan M wpadł na genialny pomysł, aby spotkanie potwierdzić co też uczynił za pośrednictwem powierzonego mu przez firmę urządzenia do komunikacji na odległość, czyli po prostu zadzwonił, aby przypomnieć się, że się do mnie wybiera.

W drzwiach stanął dość rosły człowiek w wieku około 40-tki, z kieszeni wytargał swoją wizytówkę i rozpoczęło się nasze spotkanie. Po wymianie uprzejmości przeszliśmy do konkretów. Z racji tego, że przypomniałem Panu M, że jego produkty i rozwiązania niekoniecznie mnie interesują z racji dość wątpliwej jakości, Pan M zdobył się na niesamowite w mojej ocenie śmiałe, wręcz powiedziałbym zuchwałe stwierdzenie, które stało się tytułem tego wątku.

Pan M oznajmił mi bowiem, tak dla przypomnienia zacytuję jeszcze raz

Mamy produkty tej samej jakości co Caparol, tylko że tańsze.

Wybałuszyłem oczy, spojrzałem jeszcze raz na jego wizytówkę, czy aby przypadkiem nie pomyliłem człowieka i firmy, ale nie… to był Pan M z firmy M ! Chwilę zajęło mi, aby odzyskać logiczne myślenie, facet powiedział to z takim przekonaniem, że autentycznie chyba on sam wierzył głęboko w to co mówi.

No i jak tu rozmawiać dalej? No ale dobrze, myślę sobie, wystarczy zadać kilka pytań i chłop z pewnością mnie zaskoczy tym co ma do powiedzenia. Żeby szybko określić czy to możliwe zadałem wprost pytanie cene tynku silikonowego. Oczywiście Pan M zaczął mówić, ale to zależy od ilości itd.. takie wiadomo – pieprzenie o logistyce, więc aby mu zadanie ułatwić i sprowadzić poziom cen do wspólnego mianownika z Caparolem, mówię wprost:

Proszę Pana… dostawa pełnego auta, same mokre do  mieszalnika i mieszalnik z pigmentami. Dodatkowo fura kleju jednego i drugiego.

Takie zdanie dla PH producenta od systemów dociepleń powoduje, że nogi robią się miękkie, tętno przyspiesza gwałtownie a w oczach widać błysk dolara.

Poważnie? – pyta Pan M

No tak, proszę Pana, jeżeli mielibyśmy w to wchodzić to mnie nie interesuje mniejsze zamówienie, muszę się zatowarować i mieć co sprzedawać. Później zamówienia będą mniejsze – uzupełniające, ale te pół auta zawsze się złoży.

Tu należałoby sprecyzować co usłyszał Pan M… i o co zapytałem

w jego uszach zabrzmiało to tak: 24tony tynku silikonowego, pomieszane z gruntami… to jakieś lekko licząc zamówienie na 120tys netto, mieszalnik zalany pigmentami to ok 30tys netto, no i po 24 tony kleju do styropianu i do siatki… czyli jakies c.a kolejne 32-34tys netto. Plus jakieś farbki uzupełniające, tynki mozaikowe… jednym słowem zapytałem człowieka jakie ceny da mi przy zamówieniu na c.a 200tys netto.

Pan M myślał, myślał i wymyślił… podał mi cene za tynk silikonowy o około 32% niższą w stosunku do tynku Amphisilan Fassaden Putz czyli tynku silikonowego Caparola.

No… czyli nie skłamał z ceną – byli tańsi 🙂

No to teraz jakość, jak to sprawdzić, a no trzeba zadać kilka pytań.

Pytanie 1. Panie M, w swoich systemach dociepleń i w systemie barwienia z pewnością macie jakieś ograniczenie co do współczynnika odbicia światła dla kolorów w układzie na styropianie, oraz na wełnia, w skrócie HBW. Jaki u Was jest graniczny ten współczynnik?

Pan M nie znał odpowiedzi na zadane przeze mnie pytanie, nie do końca też je chyba zrozumiał, odniosłem wrażenie, że zadałem je w obcym zupełnie nie znanym, egzotycznym języku. Skorzystałem z dobrodziejstwa jakim jest internet i znalazłem w jego karcie technicznej produktu zapis:

Tym samym zaleca się aby na dużych ciągłych powierzchniach nie stosować kolorów o współczynniku mniejszym niż 25%, gdyż może to prowadzić do powstania spękań na ich powierzchni. Stosowanie takich kolorów powinno być ograniczone do niewielkich fragmentów elewacji, detali architektonicznych, itp. Ze względu na różne bazy wyrobów (jasna, ciemna ) oraz ilości pigmentów w poszczególnych kolorach tynków mogą one różnić się od siebie gęstością i konsystencją. Większość kolorów uzyskana jest przy zastosowaniu pigmentów nieorganicznych, które posiadają bardzo wysoką odporność na działanie promieniowania UV. Kolorystyka niektórych tynków wymaga jednak zastosowania pigmentów organicznych, które ze względu na swój charakter w trakcie użytkowania ulegają nieco szybszej degradacji pod wpływem warunków pogodowych i działania promieniowania UV.

Nie powiedziałem ani słowa na temat tego co przeczytałem w karcie technicznej produktu. Oczywiście zapis ten mówił o granicy 25% HBW, urodziło mi się w głowie natychmiast pytanie sprawdzające, ale ono padnie za chwilę. Poprosiłem o wzornik. Pan M wydobył z dumą piękny książkowy wzornik kolorów, spojrzałem szybko… obok każdego koloru była nazwa, numer i np… 64% im ciemniejszy – tym ten procent mniejszy. Pytam zatem – nie ukrywam –  złośliwie… co to oznacza, te 64%?

tym razem Pan M wybałuszył oczy niczym nasz kotek ze zdjęcia. coś tam pokrętnie zaczął mówić o zawartości czegoś tam w czymś tam, coś o pigmentach. Generalnie jakaś taka właśnie nieudolnie ulepiona historia. Bez ładu i składu, pozbawiona sensu…

Powiedziałem mu, że to jest własnie HBW, a graniczne HBW dla ich produktów to 25%. Caparol Amphisilan: HBW>20%

Czy dalej uważa Pan że macie produkty tej samej jakości co Caparol tylko że tańsze?

Pan M: Oczywiście.

Pytanie 2. Panie M, zostańmy przy tych kolorach, co w przypadku, kiedy będę chciał na prawdę ciemna kolorystykę elewacji, wiem już szkoda, że nie od Pana, że graniczny u Was to 25% ?

Pan M – nie …

Panie M, w Caparol mamy system Classic na EPS HBW>20% Carbon na EPS HBW>15% oraz Carbon na wełnie HBW>5%

Czy dalej uważa Pan że macie produkty tej samej jakości co Caparol tylko że tańsze?

Pan M: Oczywiście.

Pytanie 3. Panie M, jakich pigmentów używacie do uzyskania kolorów w mieszalniku?

odpowiedź mnie rozbawiła autentycznie: gotowych.

sprecyzowałem zatem, że chodzi mi o trwałość koloru, czy są to pigmenty organiczne, czy nieorganiczne?

Nieorganiczne – stwierdził Pan M…

po tym stwierdzeniu odwróciłem laptopa i pokazałem mu zapis z JEGO karty technicznej:

Kolorystyka niektórych tynków wymaga jednak zastosowania pigmentów organicznych, które ze względu na swój charakter w trakcie użytkowania ulegają nieco szybszej degradacji pod wpływem warunków pogodowych i działania promieniowania UV.

Pan M nie miał nic do dodania…

Pytanie 4. Panie M … w strefach cokołowych budynku w systemach dociepleń stosowanie cementowych klejów do warstwy zbrojnej wiąże się z kapilarnym podciąganiem wilgoci, a w następstwie tego zjawiska do efektu odpadania zewnętrznych okładzin wskutek zamarzania wody w w/w warstwie. W jaki sposób firma M rozwiązuje ten problem?

Pan M postanowił przejść do kontrataku… zamiast odpowiedzieć zadał pytanie: a jak jest w Caparolu? Mają na to swoje rozwiązanie?

Oczywiście Panie M… mają, nawet dwa, jednym z nich jest zastosowanie Sockelflex, drugim zastosowanie kleju Carbonit. Rozumiem, że u Was jest to rozwiązane w podobny sposób i macie w ofercie tego typu produkty?

Pan M stwierdził, że nie mają.

Czy dalej uważa Pan że macie produkty tej samej jakości co Caparol tylko że tańsze?

Pan M: Oczywiście.

Generalnie tych pytań zadałem jeszcze kilka, nie pamiętam dokładnie o co zapytałem, ale z pewnością właśnie o jakieś takie detale związane stricte z trwałością, użytkowaniem, możliwościami produktów. Na żadne, powtarzam, ŻADNE pytanie nie uzyskałem sensownej odpowiedzi.

Zapytałem zatem na koniec: Panie M… ile lat już Pan w tej firmie pracuje?

Pan M odpowiedział, że prawie 10.

Czyli przez 10 ostatnich lat, jeździ Pan po firmach i opowiada Pan ludziom takie głupoty?! nie wie Pan nic o produktach które ma Pan w ofercie. Nie wstyd Panu, że przez 10 lat nie nauczył się Pan zupełnie niczego o tych swoich 30 max 40 produktach? Jedyne co Pan powtarza, to zdanie, że macie produkty takiej jakości jak Caparol tylko że tańsze?

Na jakiej podstawie Pan takie stwierdzenie stawia? Skoro nie jest Pan w stanie porównać absolutnie niczego, nie wdając się już konkretnie w detale, parametry wodochłonności, odporności mechanicznej etc.?

Mało tego, tu na miejscu niecałe 8km stąd jest Pana dystrybutor z którym handluje Pan od lat, czy on wie, że Pan wybrał się do mnie z taką ofertą? Co Pan sobie myśli?

No i Pan M na odchodne powiedział mi, że ze mną nie da się handlować i że jestem uprzedzony… Ech.

I pojechał w siną dal opowiadać dalej, że ich produkty są tej samej jakości co Caparol, tylko że tańsze.

 

 

 

599 myśli do „Mamy produkty takie same jak Caparol, tylko że tańsze ….”

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